Well, I am all for 'times are changin'', but I am not quite ready to let 1 person decide RiP is done.
Shalk, with all due respect, you are not RiP, and though you may have even been there at the beginning, you will not be the end. You just don't have that power. Thanks for the leadership in the past, but your stepping down is just that; nothing more.
RiP is over 2 years old, and I will continue wearing the tag. I am also welcoming any current and past members to continue wearing it with me. If need be, we can even recruit some new, fitting members to continue on with the reputation RiP has carried.
To former members:
What RiP means to me...
It's NOT about some lame clique, 'in crowd vs out crowd' thing, and it's not about prestige, though I am proud to be a member. It's not about friendship, though I do have friends that are and have been members.
It IS about the competition. I know that everyone else in the server wants to beat ME because I carry a tag with some history. People know the tag and the clan. They know that RiP will probably beat you most of the time, and that it's been that way for a long time. I love knowing that everyone on the server will step it up against me JUST because they want to beat the guy with the RiP tag. That is all.
No one is going to feel that way about any new clans for a long time. You can all jump on some bandwagon, and then another in 2 months if you want. Or you can keep your tag and just play. Join me if you care to, or don't. No hard feelings.
To other players looking for a clan:
I guess I will take a temporary leadership role, if all others are abandoning. And I will wait to see who sticks around. However if after a couple of weeks, I have no one back, I would be happy to consider recruits. I will limit the numbers to about what we had (12 or so), and general recruitment practices will be maintained. We can skip the circle-jerk initiation of the past. I just need to know you are compitent, you play somewhat regularily, and you will wear the tag most of the time.
Any questions, either reply publically or feel free to p-mail me if you'd like.
RiP will go on, even if I am its lone member!!
Beastie
Quote:Shalk, with all due respect, you are not RiP, and though you may have even been there at the beginning, you will not be the end. You just don't have that power.
Actually, he might. He is one of the three founders of RiP. One founder is perma-banned and one is never around anymore. Using the RiP name for
your own clan isn't really fair to those who conceived the clan. You should at least seek permission first. It's possible that this would be considered tag-stealing to the nth degree if "RiP" isn't recognized as legit or is considered stolen property.
Quote:If need be, we can even recruit some new, fitting members to continue on with the reputation RiP has carried.
All you are probably going to end up doing is tarnishing the reputation that RiP worked hard to build. Soon enough, no one will be intimidated by the RiP tag because it will be only you and a few fly-by-nighters. I'd rather go out on top then jump-the-shark as it were.
Quote:It IS about the competition.
Well, I disagre. It should have been about fun. Also, I would like to think skill was not the only contributor to RiP's positive reputation. If that was the case, then RiP truly was a "lame clique".
Personally, I was hoping you would join your friends in KFC. We would love to make room for you. KFC isn't about anything goofy or silly (that's up to the individual), it's about playing the game you like with the people you want to play with. If you only want to play alongside people just because they are leet, then that's not a healthy attitude. Will KFC be here in two months? I don't know but hopefully the spirit continues onward.
Oh yeah, I liked having you in RiP because you were genuinely a cool/nice guy. It mattered much less to me that you were any good.
beastie I know these morons were dumb but i tried also beastie they wouldnt let me. I tried also its no use man but if it works im down with you. At least its good to know i have one person by my side. Beastie you the man! Them other foo's who quitted RiP=sucks.
Well good luck is all I can say, I see KFC as a new start for me and the friends I've made while playing this game, I haven't seen it as a competitive game for a long time, it's still competitive, but it's come down to 1v1 competition. Beleive me, the game becomes a lot more fun when you lose the "play to win" attitude and just enjoy playing against people because they enjoy playing the game as much as you do. I no longer get mad when I lose or use cheap tactics that aren't as fun but guarantee a sure win.
If you do get RiP started again, and apparently with the same agenda Shalk had from the beggining, be prepared to piss a lot of members off to the point where they're not enjoying the game as much as before, even if they don't let you know.
There's still a spot for you in KFC, Beastie, and I hope you'll consider taking it, sorry if you think I'm shitting on your thread by talking about KFC so much, I do it with no disrespect.
(I actually typed a whole bunch more but I'll leave it at this)
edit:
Quote:beastie I know these morons were dumb but i tried also beastie they wouldnt let me. I tried also its no use man but if it works im down with you. At least its good to know i have one person by my side. Beastie you the man! Them other foo's who quitted RiP=sucks.
Vash I don't know what your problem with me or others is really, I didn't bring down RiP, the day before I left we were cool, but afterwards up 'til now you've been an ass for no apparent reason, you won't talk to me about what's wrong, so how should I know what the problem is? You want to restart RiP, fine, nobody even replied to that post, so don't make shit up, it seemed absurd to me, and still does, specially from someone that just rejoined after being kicked out by a leader. The truth is you wouldn't have been re-recruited if you didn't get the support from veterans like myself, so just lose it bro. We don't have to wear the same tag to be friends in-game and out, and you gotta understand that I didn't leave because of you. I wish we could be cool again, but as long as you keep the ego (I'M THE BEST), you're no better than Shalk or anybody else that just wanted to join RiP for the sole reason to be among the better group of players.
Contrary to what several people may beleive, most better players could care less if they lose or win, as long as they're having good games. Stop with the drama.
_Acid_Head_,Nov 12 2004, 03:59 AM Wrote:Well good luck is all I can say, I see KFC as a new start for me and the friends I've made while playing this game, I haven't seen it as a competitive game for a long time, it's still competitive, but it's come down to 1v1 competition. Beleive me, the game becomes a lot more fun when you lose the "play to win" attitude and just enjoy playing against people because they enjoy playing the game as much as you do. I no longer get mad when I lose or use cheap tactics that aren't as fun but guarantee a sure win.
If you do get RiP started again, and apparently with the same agenda Shalk had from the beggining, be prepared to piss a lot of members off to the point where they're not enjoying the game as much as before, even if they don't let you know.
There's still a spot for you in KFC, Beastie, and I hope you'll consider taking it, sorry if you think I'm shitting on your thread by talking about KFC so much, I do it with no disrespect.
(I actually typed a whole bunch more but I'll leave it at this)
edit:
Quote:beastie I know these morons were dumb but i tried also beastie they wouldnt let me. I tried also its no use man but if it works im down with you. At least its good to know i have one person by my side. Beastie you the man! Them other foo's who quitted RiP=sucks.
Vash I don't know what your problem with me or others is really, I didn't bring down RiP, the day before I left we were cool, but afterwards up 'til now you've been an ass for no apparent reason, you won't talk to me about what's wrong, so how should I know what the problem is? You want to restart RiP, fine, nobody even replied to that post, so don't make shit up, it seemed absurd to me, and still does, specially from someone that just rejoined after being kicked out by a leader. The truth is you wouldn't have been re-recruited if you didn't get the support from veterans like myself, so just lose it bro. We don't have to wear the same tag to be friends in-game and out, and you gotta understand that I didn't leave because of you. I wish we could be cool again, but as long as you keep the ego (I'M THE BEST), you're no better than Shalk or anybody else that just wanted to join RiP for the sole reason to be among the better group of players.
Contrary to what several people may beleive, most better players could care less if they lose or win, as long as they're having good games. Stop with the drama.
Im The Best. Period. Im the best arena Player ever I proved it to razor the other day i have no reason to talk any of you guys my job was to be the best and now i am so i have no reason to talk to you guys. I loss complete friendship to all you guys especially razora nd shalk becuz they decided to end the clan it was dumb. If you didnt feel liek the clan was the same you cuolda got the fudge out and let someone else run it. Just like how you let other leaders lead because they arent active enough to run the clan. Quit whining about my name and quit tryin to talk to me i dont wanna talk to you as you see for the past 2 or 3 days. Just leave me be i leave you be, I dont know you you dont know me. End of story.
um... what?
Take this crap to another thread, Vash.
My entire point, perspective, and attitude are a million miles away from yours.
I want allies, but you are far from helping.
You are the best? Great. Find a new challenge.
Let's keep it on track, folks.
And I do appreciate the rest of the feedback. I will not be replying to any of it for a few days, as I want to see what the others have to say.
Beast
Beastie, look at .asm replay, u will learn something.
Im the only founder of the clan that left around, RulePool2 was perm gone, KillingSpree isn't in the clan anymore, he past his job to g-boy and g-boy to Razor, so yes. If 2 of the leaders + 1 of the founders of RiP decide to break up RiP, hell we got the power.
If u really planing on starting to recuit ppl and keep RiP alive then i will count it as tag steal and u know i have the right ppl to talk with about it.
Yes, this is a double post, but Shalk addressed me in both threads, just want to make sure I drive thr points.
Shalk,
Sorry bud, can't take it away from an active member. It's Not Yours to Take Away.
We said the same thing when you tried to remove Acid and the clan kept him anyway.
You talked about just quitting then, too. And we decided that RiP is RiP and long as ANY of its members continue to wear the tag.
You can't make me take it off any more than I can make you wear it.
But bottom line is this: They may have Empowered you to make RiP disappear.
I will not.
To all else, this is not a hostile action. It's the exact opposite.
I appreciate the feedback and many of your points are valid.
I remain unchanged.
Beast
Well, I'm looking at both sides here.
Shalk simply wants the tag gone, but he gives no good reason, again showing the person I disliked while in the clan, basically "The clan is mine, I started it, I finish it, period".
Razor doesn't want to tarnish RiP's reputation by giving you the key and later recruiting random people giving the tag a bad name.
Beastie, I'm making a guess here, wants former RiP members to return (I'm hoping without a few that don't belong in my idea of what RiP should've been like the whole time) by reviving the clan.
What it comes down to is this, and this is MY opinion: RiP was always about the members, hell, the rules agreed upon just a little while ago gave as much power to the members as it did to the three leaders combined, those rules were posted by the awesome Rulepool2, he had the right idea of what the clan was supposed to be about, give as much power to the members as to the leaders. Truth is, no offense to Rulepool or Razor, the leaders did very little to shape the clan into what it eventually became, we didn't have to recruit, people asked to join, we didn't have to compete, there was NO competition, so what were they? IMO nothing more than members themselves, just veteran members, but more than anything, status symbols.
You guys are making way too big a deal out of this, and if Beastie, a veteran member, wants to keep the spirit alive, you should let him, NOT anyone, I say Beastie because he's a good guy and has proven himself to be a friendly, loyal person to RiP and has been in it for a very long time. You know what happens if Beastie takes over and RiP *DOES* go to shit? Not much really, because like I said, the clan was always about the members, not the tag or Shalk, whatever tag the core members decide to use will be recognized because of its members and their positive, playful, and/or charismatic attitude. I understand Razor wants to leave RiP on a good note, that it had these kinds of members, but it doesn't mean it can't be revived, specially when it's already off to a good start with someone like Beastie leading, I mean, Vash as a leader is absurd, anybody that's been in RiP long than three months would agree with me after reading what he typed up in this thread, but Beastie? Why not? I had a really bad feeling that Beastie was acting up like Vash before I talked to him in-game, that's probably what you two need to do. After that, you've got to give a better explanation than "because I say so".
The tag-stealing issue is an admin issue...not mine. I refuse to get involved as far as that is concerned. I think it would be a nice gesture for Shalk to give Beastie the "rights"...and I don't see the actual harm it would do. As Acid said, if it goes to shit, it goes to shit...we all know that RiP was awesome either way.
I'm really dismayed with what is going on now. I still don't truly understand Beastie's point of view. It doesn't matter to me if people were intimidated by my tag. I used to feel like Beastie does about RiP but I was inspired by Acid's attitude recently. The attitude that it is the people that make a difference...not the tag/status. Even if RiP was the worst-skilled clan in Ricochet (it was by chance the best), I would have still wanted to tag up....because the people I like were there. Beastie, if you do end up as the only RiP player alive, would that be fun for you? Are you having fun now? When does a computer-game become about something else rather than amusement?
The truth is, I would may have left anyways with Acid and lil face out of the clan (and hoped that Beastie followed suit). That doesn't mean anyone else would have followed however. Still, if we all end up back with RiP, that's the way it is...and we would could make it even better than before...I'm convinced. However, I am somewhat excited and curious about new opportunites. Yeah, you could say I'm torn on the issue...I was in RiP a long time and didn't expect it to end up this way.
I still don't understeand what is the problem? U ARE WELCOME TO OPEN UR OWN CLAN, this clan was builded by me, RP2 and KillingSpree (Razor9 place now), we decided to close it, don't like it? u are welcome to build ur own clan. what the hell we are asking? to respect our decision? is that so hard? IF u will use the tag i will count it as tag steal and I WILL act some steps.
Oh just let him keep RiP alive, whats the damn big deal? I can't really understand how it could be a tag steal.
Quote:u are welcome to build ur own clan.
Well he's trying to do that. You are not in RiP anymore. Since Beastie would be the only member at the start it would be his clan.
That you closed a clan called RiP means no one can use that name anymore?
Here is my input, didn't really read all the thread besides Beasties original post and what Shalk and I talked about this morning.
First off I feel that how RiP was ended was wrong. I think that it should of been voted on between the clan members and that would of let anyone like Beastie to step up and say he would want to take over. This could of led to a vote of Yes, lets bring new leadership to the clan or lets just end it and whatever was decided, everyone would have to follow the decision.
But since that didn't happen, and everyone just "abandonded ship" and Beastie is the only member left, then I feel like that he can continue on with RiP and of course he would be leader of course, only one left.
Just my opinion.
Trigun.Vash.Ace.Shot,Nov 12 2004, 07:06 AM Wrote:Im The Best. Period. Im the best arena Player ever I proved it to razor the other day i have no reason to talk any of you guys my job was to be the best and now i am so i have no reason to talk to you guys. I loss complete friendship to all you guys especially razora nd shalk becuz they decided to end the clan it was dumb. If you didnt feel liek the clan was the same you cuolda got the fudge out and let someone else run it. Just like how you let other leaders lead because they arent active enough to run the clan. Quit whining about my name and quit tryin to talk to me i dont wanna talk to you as you see for the past 2 or 3 days. Just leave me be i leave you be, I dont know you you dont know me. End of story.
Haha, keep telling yourself that vash.
RuNnInG_wIth_ScISsOrS,Nov 12 2004, 02:03 PM Wrote:Trigun.Vash.Ace.Shot,Nov 12 2004, 07:06 AM Wrote:Im The Best. Period. Im the best arena Player ever I proved it to razor the other day i have no reason to talk any of you guys my job was to be the best and now i am so i have no reason to talk to you guys. I loss complete friendship to all you guys especially razora nd shalk becuz they decided to end the clan it was dumb. If you didnt feel liek the clan was the same you cuolda got the fudge out and let someone else run it. Just like how you let other leaders lead because they arent active enough to run the clan. Quit whining about my name and quit tryin to talk to me i dont wanna talk to you as you see for the past 2 or 3 days. Just leave me be i leave you be, I dont know you you dont know me. End of story.
Haha, keep telling yourself that vash.
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
Quickening,Nov 12 2004, 01:04 PM Wrote:RuNnInG_wIth_ScISsOrS,Nov 12 2004, 02:03 PM Wrote:Trigun.Vash.Ace.Shot,Nov 12 2004, 07:06 AM Wrote:Im The Best. Period. Im the best arena Player ever I proved it to razor the other day i have no reason to talk any of you guys my job was to be the best and now i am so i have no reason to talk to you guys. I loss complete friendship to all you guys especially razora nd shalk becuz they decided to end the clan it was dumb. If you didnt feel liek the clan was the same you cuolda got the fudge out and let someone else run it. Just like how you let other leaders lead because they arent active enough to run the clan. Quit whining about my name and quit tryin to talk to me i dont wanna talk to you as you see for the past 2 or 3 days. Just leave me be i leave you be, I dont know you you dont know me. End of story.
Haha, keep telling yourself that vash.
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::P:P:lol::lol:
Shalk, I am not asking for your approval. But I appreciate your opinion, and you take whatever actions you see necessary. ((what is it you think you can do, exactly? lol))
Here is how I see it, however.
Sure, you played a part in starting the clan... 2+ years ago. And you even loosely led the group for most of that time. You are misunderstanding what this means. You are acting as if you OWNED the clan and its members. You do not, did not, and will not.
2 months after the clan began, you might have been able to just call it all off. But RiP became something bigger than you. It will survive without you, your leadership, your name on it's roster, and above all... without your approval.
If you remember, when I finally let you talk me into joining, I told you I would play under RiP as long as I play the game. That will not change.
Some of the guys are starting to see that my reasons for keeping my tag are pure and simple. Others still wonder why I bother. Again, even if I remain the sole member and the only one to wear the tag, you really have given up your right to have any say about it.
You stepped down. You left it all behind. Whether to save face when you saw members leaving or instead to spite those by whom you felt betrayed, I am not sure why you felt you could just dump it. I personally think it was to gain some quick attention, but now I am being judgmental and I try to avoid that. Regardless, my position remains the same.
I am not going to start another clan, not with Vash or anybody. I am simply not leaving my old one.
Beastie
Quote:But RiP became something bigger than you. It will survive without you, your leadership, your name on it's roster, and above all... without your approval.
Did u stoped for a momment and though how it became big? u think i didn't had somehing with it? ITS NOT BIGGER THEN ME, ITS BIGGER THX TO ME! don't ever say it like i did nothing, u know how much i had to talk with ppl like Knightmare, Razor9, Gemakk, u think they came by thier own? NO! I HAD TO TALK WITH EACH ONE! Thx to me we had such ppl in the clan, SO DON'T EVER SAY ITS BIGGER THEN ME! god u became rude, i didn't know u had it in u. U got my dissapointed
Steeling the tag of a clan that doesn't exist?
noone can punish that.
Staying in a clan although all other members leave?
noone can punish that either.
go Beastie, go
hmmmm for exampel if there is 1000clans called RiP... then one of them accidently joins with his cs tag on.. is he punished ?
Yeah Shalk I'm sure they joined just because you talked to them, it had nothing to do with existing members:rolleyes:You give yourself way too much credit.
no acid, but its just that im not getting credit at all, im like a ghost, nobody listen to me and nobody respect me. and anyway if u want some proves for me giving me credits i can show u logs and PM's with me asking them.
Shalk,Nov 12 2004, 02:56 PM Wrote:no acid, but its just that im not getting credit at all, im like a ghost, nobody listen to me and nobody respect me. and anyway if u want some proves for me giving me credits i can show u logs and PM's with me asking them.
I give you credit for starting the clan, but many of the core members joined because of existing members, asking them to join just lets them know that they're wanted in. You have to earn respect, and you fail to realize just why people respect Rulepool and Razor more than they respect you, maybe it has something to do with them respecting the members as much, did that ever cross your mind?
Let me tell you all something, when Rulepool2 came up with new RiP rules, giving members more power, there was one option we had that was to start a vote to kick a leader out of the clan, guess who the only person that whined about that rule was.
Well the reason im all pissy about the clan being completely dead and everything. Because no one voted at all , NOT 1 vote in the forum was posted about should we end the clan. Werent we a clan. Dont we vote on stuff to add members or make a rash decision. My question is why wasnt a vote cast. Just becuz you (shalk) and razor and like prolly 1 other person felt it wasnt the same doesent mean that everyone else feels the same way as you feel. So what if all the old members werent active, what beastie doing is right im behind him the whole way.
But man that wasnt coo at all none of you 2 even asked to our oponions to get help on the situation. So we can certain things out. It was just you and razor talking and than the next day BaM! the whole clan is dead. I mean wtf I have my reasons to be upset about this whole RiP thing and you ask why? Especially someone like me who has been kicked out and given a 2nd chance and Played as active as possible just to represent. WHy would you end something so fast man you didtn even think twice about the members oponions both of you just ended it becuz you 2 felt like the clan wasnt the same. Thats garbage and the lamest reason in the world to end something.
Is it me or have you forgetten their are like 20 members that were in. And out of those 20 members the (2) leaders decided to end it. DIdnt even ask for the rest of the 18 members. But even if im over exaggerating the members you still get what im saying.
lol acid about that part about shalk whining that is true i wander what he has to say when he reads this im waiting.
With all that being said Shalk, it's all in the past. You helped to recruit, sure. But now you quit.
Doesn't give you the right to flush the clan down with you.
YOU don't want to lead anymore.
YOU don't want to wear the tag anymore.
YOU don't want to recruit new members.
YOU don't want anyone to wear the tag anymore if you won't be.
YOU think that YOU are synonomous with RiP.
YOU think that RiP can not go on without you.
YOU can have your opinions and leave as you please.
YOU can think and want what YOU want.
YOU are mistaken about a number of things, however.
YOU should have handled it a bit less childishly.
I have no reason to dislike you, Shalk. And as mad as you may get, I will not return the same. I plan to be friendly in game, and will happily chat with you on MSN. I have no personal hard feelings. I never do, it's a silly game.
But I will wear the tag and I will maintain the clan.
Beastie
I've read enough. If Shalk and Razor were disatisified with the clan, then they should have quit and not try and ruin it for everyone else. It's that simple. I am asking the administration here and everyone else to recognize RiP as an active clan. It would be great if the RiP forums were restored and mod abilities given to Beastie as a sign of validation.
Just my .02$
(blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah)squared
edited by GRITS
Olbest,Nov 12 2004, 09:53 PM Wrote:Steeling the tag of a clan that doesn't exist?
noone can punish that.
Staying in a clan although all other members leave?
noone can punish that either.
go Beastie, go
you know what olbest you made very good since tehre the clan doesnt exist so where does any rule say its stealing a tag if it doesnt exist.
I mean it does exist to me still i want to bring it back as i rationally acted as soon as i first saw i tried to take over. No one owns the clan so we have the right to start out own and call it *RiP* how can you stop that? shalk its not yours no more remember you and razor tore it down. You threaten that I would get banned if i brought it up in irc.
explain how will i get banned now just tell me since you can make good decisions like shutting things down.
Thing is, the admins are staying neutral in this situation, there is absolutely nothing Shalk can do if Beastie decides to go ahead and keep RiP alive since it isn't recognized as an existing clan at this point. It's sad really, me and Razor talked about this, and he agreed when I said that this would all come down to stupid technicalities.